Interview with Sophie Stone, Macbeth at Lyric Hammersmith
Conducted by Emmie for Theatre and Tonic
A visceral and contemporary new production of Shakespeare’s Macbeth heads to the Lyric Hammersmith from 28 February. Originally co-produced by ETT, Shakespeare North Playhouse, Northern Stage and Théâtres de la Ville de Luxembourg, in association with Bristol Old Vic - this version of Macbeth speaks to a world we find ourselves living in now. Ahead of its opening, we spoke with Sophie Stone who plays Ross in the production to find out more.
Hi Sophie to begin with, you have done a vast variety of different shows already in your career - including The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time and Emilia etc. What have been your highlights when it comes to shows you’ve worked on before?
The first big show I did was Mother Courage And Her Children at the National Theatre which taught me so much about theatre family and how important ensemble is, this carried on in both Curious and Emilia in ways I could never have imagined. Emilia wasn’t just a show, but a movement and each job I grow on, and learn about myself, I also take with me the strength of solidarity. When The Deaf & Hearing Ensemble (a theatre company I’m co-founder of) and The Globe encouraged and believed in my ability to translate Shakespeare into Theatre Sign (a mix of BSL, SSE and physical imagery), I fell in love with the words and all their possibilities – painting meaning into thin air. Other memorable jobs: Getting ripped with Mother Courage from hauling a wagon the weight of an immobile car 8 shows a week; flying around the stage for the amazing Frantic Assembly; playing roles such as Jaques & Iago and bringing something new and layered; also Punk shows, Queer shows, being part of shows that change the world a little bit, whether questioning or altering perceptions, people’s lives or needed change & conversation; the joy and purpose of theatre is to highlight, challenge, provoke and celebrate and I feel fortunate to be part of shows that have done exactly that.
How has this variety in your career prepared you to play the role of Ross in ETT’s production of Macbeth?
Finding ways to translate Shakespeare! Understanding space, both of that around you onstage and physically in your body. To remember to make bold choices and trust my voice. How to continue to be generous to your team and appreciate the unsung heroes of Designers, Directors (music, movement, assistant, as much as the boss!), Technical Creative, Stage Managers et al. I recently co-directed The Winter’s Tale with a small theatre company and being on the other side of the ‘table’ in a rehearsal room made me fall in love with ‘play’ all over again – actors can be incredibly generous with ideas and offers, and over the years I feel I’ve become more fearful of making bad offers, getting it wrong, failing... but it’s been a refreshing reminder that letting go of that fear and making is mess is exactly where the gold gets uncovered.
The room we’re in at the ETT is one of the most playful, supportive, fearless rooms I’ve been in for a while and everyone has rekindled that fire to “fail, fail again, fail better” till something good this way comes. I’m learning to shed defences I’ve built up over the years and be less afraid & less fixated on perfection. This doesn’t come out of vanity but in years of trying to prove I’m worth the spaces I’m in - not letting my disability be the ammunition people seek for not hiring me but rather the beneficial addition I can be towards a show’s success, meaning I can’t be seen to fail.
You have done some Shakespeare work before, how do you think it keeps its relevance to modern audiences and why do you think it continues to have appeal?
When on Mother Courage, Tony Kushner (playwright who wrote our adaptation of Brecht’s show) said ‘The face of war never changes’ - we looked through photographs of nearly every war on our planet since recorded time and it’s true. The weapons, landscape and uniforms may differ but the face of human suffering, destruction and the collective yearn for its end, along with the clean face of power and the deeds of the corrupt, remains the same. However love, war, politics or power looks today, the human and animalistic drive under all that is what we’re built upon, so whatever timeline we exist on, it’ll always be relevant. Shakespeare’s works are purely studies in human behaviour. At the core of it all, if you look closely enough, you’ll find yourself in there somewhere.
This production of Macbeth is billed as stylish, contemporary and gut-wrenching - how would you explain that to new audiences?
Emma Whipday zoomed into a rehearsal day and spoke to us on her studies (which is now a book: Shakespeare’s Domestic Tragedies – Violence In The Early Modern Home) and we discussed the roles of the characters who live or are invited in these homes – the violence that happens internally and externally to these minds and spaces throw up possibilities and claustrophobic limitations. The perfect recipe for Macbeth.
Our staging feels like one modern room in which the whole world comes crashing through. There’s European theatre influences and the rulebook for how Shakespeare ‘should’ be done has been ripped up, making it accessible to the contemporary experience and real-time processing; whilst making you question what’s real and what’s not. It’s dizzying, desperate, destructive and defying. Just how I like my theatre!
You play the role of Ross in the production. How have you developed this character and what do you think his role is in the story? Is he a bystander, a manipulator, or something in between?
This version of Ross is a woman, the only woman in this male-dominated army and possibly the only female Thane in Scotland. She’s tough, flawed, tries to fit in and probably trusts too much until she’s shown otherwise. She’s also bisexual and has a lot of love for Lady Macduff, her cousin’s wife, which makes things all the more painful, complex and harmful in a world of chaos that requires you to not stop. The world continues to turn - death is a violent sorrow, a modern ecstasy (a relentless trend) so we must keep moving to fight back and save what’s left. As we are reminded in our current world. Ross believes there is good in people and will, regardless of the risks, keep faith in you to come through. She struggles with an alcohol addiction to numb her PTSD and wears a joker facade to survive. She doesn’t really belong anywhere and struggles with right and wrong, just wanting to be accepted. She’s fiercely loyal to Malcolm whom she helped raised. She toys with the audience, suggesting being a gatekeeper for Hell – she sees you all & knows she’s going to join you, so might as well have a party! It’s bittersweet but she’s the underdog I’d cheer on.
Ross has been a hard character to develop, specifically because she could be played in so many ways, but I think all characters should be hard to figure out – the more human and relatable the characters, the scarier it is when they do monstrous things because then we’re all capable of the same. We’re two weeks into rehearsal so she could still change....
Macbeth is such an intense play that covers strong themes of ambition, power and betrayal. How do you personally connect to that and apply it to your take on Ross?
Sometimes ambition can come from a place of loss, an outreached hand toward a gap in the clouds. When desperation meets desperation there can only be one outcome. Did the king utilise on destructive personalities to gain and keep power, or were good people destroyed by circumstance (by order of the king)? Being fed awards for the violence done, as proof of loyalty, is one way to make monsters – how people are turned into machines is something I’ve always been fascinated by: I see the army as a cult – the desensitisation and coercion of a mass group of people is not something I’ve experienced but I understand trying to hold onto yourself and individuality whilst living in community, wanting what you can’t have, grief and having to do things you don’t want to do to survive. Also, as most of us may feel, living under an oppressive system that sees you as a number rather than a human life. I personally connect to Ross’ need to hold onto hope. If she doesn’t, what else is there. Her friends, comrades, are her family, that’s where (ultimately) her power lies.
What is it like being working on a production like ETT and have there been any challenges in developing this work?
It’s been interesting stepping into a returning show that doesn’t expect you to keep things the same. With ‘Curious Incident’ we were, in many ways, stepping into the blueprint of a ten year run of the show – though every actor will have brought their own flavour and experience to the characters, the successful outline was the same. But on this, we were encouraged to change it all up and find juxtapositions, adding our life experiences and true perspectives or question what else theatre can be. It’s been so fun and refreshing to be trusted and nurtured in this way. There’s an honesty in our discussions about what we can throw in and should leave out & all ideas are listened to and welcomed. I’m so grateful for the generosity of the room, and any access issues are dealt with such immediacy and care without othering or made to feel a weight, so we can all just get on with doing our jobs.
In this production, are there any particular staging or directorial choices that have transformed your understanding of Ross or the play as a whole?
I’ve done a fair few projects on the Macbeths and have explored the ways in which their relationship evolves and behaviours stem from, but now I’m understanding the other characters complicities and responses in such a claustrophobic environment. It becomes clearer, with our version, how at risk everyone is. The tv show ‘Traitors’ has been a reoccurring reference point in rehearsals, so there is an element of Big Brother, watching a social experiment happen in front of our eyes. I’m a visual person by nature and love when things are physicalised, either literally, metaphorically or abstractly. When we inject European theatre flavours into the mix (thinking back to Sean Holmes’ & Simon Stephens’ Three Kingdoms - also at the Lyric) things are unlocked. The Brechtian flavour of the Porter of Hell speech that happens after a celebration, suddenly feels like an invitation to the after-party, the consequence of a life of toxic pleasure: Enjoy it while it lasts, the bill is coming! How to explore shellshock/PTSD, whilst carrying yourselves as ‘heroes’. How do you lose or hold onto humanity when a hundred killings on the field is a celebration but one in the home is a downfall: what happens when the battlefield is *in* your home? The staging of private scenes in full sight and close proximity of those you’re hiding from adds to the dangerous tension, risk and blatancy of choosing sides – it, among others, exposes Ross’ friendship with Lennox and how Lennox is a true Scot, choosing his country, regardless of the tyrant that’s destroying it, which she totally gets but consistently tries to save him. She speaks of it being a cruel time, when we do seemingly traitorous deeds for the greater good, to go against your country in order to save it. The juxtapositions expose more script clarity in rehearsals, but we have to make sure it lands for those watching – every decision has to carry you, like saddling a wild horse, through to the final destination.
If you could give one piece of advice to someone stepping into the role of Ross for the first time, what would it be?
Be bold with your exploration, make the role your own, understand what drives Ross (in your version) and commit to that intention. The stronger the intention and the more light & shade you can find (humans are complex creatures), the more likely you’ll find the truth of the character and play your own truth within that. Create a relationship tree/cloud and find the connections to everyone else in the world of ‘Macbeth’ - who do you support, love, are loyal to and when and why does that change? What drives you, what do you desire, what is stopping you? Research what the landscape you’re in looks like, where you’ve come from at the top of the play, how the environment you’re in affects you. What are your frailties/vulnerabilities and how do you show or not show them. Build your character with questions and explore the physical manifestations of the answers. Do not be afraid to make a mess and not have answers – this might be exactly where the character exists.
Finally, why should people feel encouraged to come and see Macbeth at the Lyric Hammersmith?
For a start, this is pure theatre – imagination, supernatural, politics and human fuckery (complexities, for a clean edit!). It’s like a psychological horror played out in almost real-time. It makes Shakespeare’s words and characters clearer and penetrable. The characters are relatable and recognisable, whether within ourselves, socially, or as caricatures of rulers we may know in the world today. It speaks of grief, desire, greed and questions what loyalty is. There’s exploration of visual language: physical, signed, lighting; and the layers of sound, time and space will make you feel what you can’t articulate. There are immersive moments and the edits will take you on a rollercoaster ride that’ll end with a gasp. It’s not one to miss.
Catch Sophie Stone in Macbeth at Lyric Hammersmith from 28 Feb - 29 March 2025.
